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Post by nyx on Jun 8, 2018 2:22:39 GMT
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Post by purr on Jun 11, 2018 14:11:15 GMT
...MEOW... ...TOO...!! (Equality, Man, Robots, my bruised donkey.. all make a grab for... ..figures)
Uh.. actually all the equality stuff is our (enlightenment societies') great experiment, including that great idea that we should treat everybody the same under the same circumstances. Like should apply to any ...any... two law abiding citizens, say both accused of the same crime in a court of law (leading to exactly the same judgement). (Doesn't always work, because some of our equals can afford better lawyers. ) Simply imo it is the Law that declares us Equals, and then lets history play out in hope of creating a just and happy society. Equality = an Ideal = Law which rewards Fairness.
There is a problem with that, Nyx. Humans are not born equal, nor 'created' equal. Iin fact each of us is born with a different set of physical and psychological traits, with considerable emphasis on competitiveness. Just think what it is like to start life with low I.Q. and/or physical disability and/or in a family that has had generations of not overly bright, low status, low income participants. If one is unlucky in the gene pool, getting equal treatment, earning normal income, basically SURVIVING may prove a struggle even in modern democratic nations of law. Everybody knows there's a minority of smart folks (who lucked out!) who prey on the (relatively) less lucky, the dumb and the poor. I'm not at all sure why we should let robots into the circle of human equality. Because they (will) have become Self Aware. What 'self' is that exactly? What mechanism of 'awareness'? By what programming did they 'better themselves'? If even humans, sharing a single evolution, a single genome, have ways to go figuring out how to treat others fairly, as equals yes, while struggling with deep rooted differences between individuals and groups, why go extend this experimental social behavior to incredibly smart machines that just now have begun to think for themselves? If I were an all new supersmart self aware robot given equal rights by my human creators, I might be grateful and play nice. Or I might at some point enslave those same humans, who on average are a bunch of idiots with a chip on their shoulder (who already made a mess), to work at our Global Maintenance Department until they outlived their usefulness. In case my parts wear out. I am also thinking about taking a cat or building a cobalt fission device. Thinking.....thinking.............
purr
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Post by HAL on Jun 11, 2018 19:30:46 GMT
Anyone got Isaac Asimov's phone number ?
As he's dead it may be ex-directory.
HAL
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Post by purr on Jun 11, 2018 20:16:46 GMT
Anyone got Isaac Asimov's phone number ? As he's dead it may be ex-directory. HAL In his books , GOOD MORNING HAL. "“All normal life, Peter, consciously or otherwise, resents domination. If the domination is by an inferior, or by a supposed inferior, the resentment becomes stronger. Physically, and, to an extent, mentally, a robot—any robot—is superior to human beings. What makes him slavish, then? Only the First Law! Why, without it, the first order you tried to give a robot would result in your death. Unstable? What do you think?” ― Isaac Asimov, I, Robot "
purr
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Post by HAL on Jun 12, 2018 22:18:52 GMT
Purr,
..why go extend this experimental social behavior to incredibly smart machines that just now have begun to think for themselves?..
There is a discussion going on at Fortean Times where someone is suggesting that AI can not achieve this state.
HAL
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Post by nyx on Jun 13, 2018 0:25:26 GMT
Robots having emotions, logic, cognition, probabilities, it will not happen.
I am afraid there is no Data ( actor Brent Spiner ) from Star Trek.
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Post by skizicks on Jun 13, 2018 2:15:00 GMT
Man has by his societal advancements all but stopped his own evolution. No longer does the right to procreate go to the strongest, fastest, or smartest. The proof of this can be seen on daytime television where people cannot even be sure just who fathered which child. Success is no longer a matter of being a good farmer, warrior, or whatever. Even education that great helping hand to success has been replaced by a smartphone and Google. Sooner or later a program will appear that very closely mirrors human thinking patterns. And, sooner or later we hill develop a robot that can move at will and take care of its self. When the two combine we will either be in deep trouble, or we will revive slavery. Probably both. The three laws of robotics are science fiction after all.
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Post by purr on Jun 14, 2018 11:11:03 GMT
Purr, .. why go extend this experimental social behavior to incredibly smart machines that just now have begun to think for themselves?.. There is a discussion going on at Fortean Times where someone is suggesting that AI can not achieve this state. HAL
purr
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Post by HAL on Jun 14, 2018 21:37:36 GMT
Ah yes, there it is.. One moment please.
(Sound of many clasps latching).
That's better.
So, if the demise of the world is to be down to too many proles with nothing to do using up valuable and irreplaceable resources while being of no actual use to the productive members of society, then (awkward, this) is there a case for, if not actually eliminating them, then for stopping them err 'multiplying ?
We no longer have wars that bring things back into equilibrium, so canon fodder isn't needed (no cannons to feed).
So, while you are all sharpening up your keyboards and priming your flame throwers (why do you think I was putting on my industrial strength asbestos greatcoat before I launched into this) spare a moment from planning my ritual roasting to consider what else is there to do..really.
Sitting on one's hands and bemoaning the situation isn't really a viable long-term option.
HAL
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Post by moksha on Jun 15, 2018 0:52:42 GMT
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Post by HAL on Jun 15, 2018 21:14:56 GMT
Moksha, I preferred the original Tron. More BASIC, one may say.
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Post by moksha on Jun 15, 2018 21:44:43 GMT
Moksha, I preferred the original Tron. More BASIC, one may say. Kinda knew that, I wish to, put you all to quest, I have yet to see or play this song in any juke box, i have seen, I have seen many, LETS GET THIS SONG PLAYED EVERYWHERE NOW
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Post by HAL on Jun 16, 2018 19:02:38 GMT
moksha,
Clicking on the above caused my computer to freeze.
I could only get out of this by crashing out. I.e. turning off the power.
Something not recommended.
HAL
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Post by moksha on Jun 17, 2018 10:59:59 GMT
moksha, Clicking on the above caused my computer to freeze. I could only get out of this by crashing out. I.e. turning off the power. Something not recommended. HAL Why would that happen ? Are you sure it's not your Machine ? Has any others had their Machine freeze ?
link about equal rights, from
Tesla
Maybe your Machine will play this one.
MKW
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Post by skizicks on Jun 20, 2018 15:59:22 GMT
Hal, I think we may already be in the situation where we are producing far too many people who contribute nothing to society and yet demand access to the very best in living arraignments, food, and "toys" that society has to offer. America has tens of millions who feel for certain that the country owes them a middle class lifestyle even though they make no efforts to take care of themselves or improve their situations. Millions more feel that the country owes the same lifestyle to people who are not even citizens. All while demanding that the country support the rest of the planet by buying their goods and services and paying for their defense while our own factories and military fall further and further behind.
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