chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Sept 28, 2023 23:04:18 GMT
Since the dawn of mankind, the stars in the sky have been a great fascination for us humans, leading to questions such as: What are they? Where are they? From that time on, we have come up with numerous techniques in order to help provide answers to those questions.
First, we have built and sent satellites (the voyagers) to explore and map our solar system. And eventually, continue to fly beyond our solar system into outer space in hopes that someone will notice at least one of those satellites, and will at some point in time lead to the Earth's discovery.
Then, we began sending radio signals/waves into outer space, hoping that they [the signals] will someday be received, deciphered, acknowledged and responded to by some intelligent exoplanetary lifeforms.
After that, we started searching for satellites circling distant planets, which could be an indication that there may be some one living on one of those planets. Plus, we started looking for water, atmosphere and many other ways to make some sort of contact with our cosmic siblings.
Now, it is difficult to say which one of these tricks we have implemented in order to reach our goal of making contact with extraterrestrial beings will yield results first. That is anybody's guess. So, place your bets folks, on which one of those techniques will come through for us first.
My money is on the radio waves we have been sending into space. I feel those waves will be received and responded to before anything else--which could happen any day now. Therefore, I have the champagne ready to pop open for when they [the aliens] do just that--respond to us.
|
|
|
Post by HAL on Sept 29, 2023 19:28:29 GMT
You have made an assumption upon all the things you wrote are based.
You are assuming that the purpose was to draw attention to our signals, sats etc by other worldly beings.
I would suggest that the purpose was for 'US' to look for otherworldly things. We have been sending out radio signals for a very long time. It has been suggested that we really aught not to be doing that. If some other entity is receiving our signals and also has the capability of space travel at a much higher level than we do, do we really want them coming here ?
It could be analogous to migrants looking across the world at countries that are better organised than their own and saying 'Hery, let's go there and take the place over'.
I say don't do it.
|
|
chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Sept 29, 2023 23:16:24 GMT
There may already be exoplanetary beings out there, or perhaps nearby, that are more technologically sophisticated than we are, and they might already be aware of our existence. But have chosen not to make contact with us no matter what we do--waves and all. So, we could just be wasting our time and effort. However, some scientists feel the need to try and do something anyway.
|
|
|
Post by HAL on Sept 30, 2023 11:41:43 GMT
There may already be exoplanetary beings out there, or perhaps nearby, that are more technologically sophisticated than we are, and they might already be aware of our existence. But have chosen not to make contact with us no matter what we do--waves and all. So, we could just be wasting our time and effort. However, some scientists feel the need to try and do something anyway. I agree that there night be other tech entities out there. But we are not seeing evidence of it.
Bearing in mind that our own space exploration is geared to the eventual spreading of the human race to other planets, Don't you think that other entities may have the same idea ?
|
|
chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Oct 13, 2023 11:11:10 GMT
I take my money back. I now think that it may be a Mars rover, not the waves we sent out into space that will encounter outer worldly life first. There may be ancient microbes somewhere on Mars--a sign of life having briefly developed there--before life began and became finalized here on Earth.
However, would finding life on Mars, be considered the discovery of Alien life? After all, the fourth planet is a part of our solar system--not really outer space. Whereas Venus is Earth' sister, Mars is our brother. It' hard to say. But finding small unearthly life, anywhere in our solar, would definitely boost the theory of life existing elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by HAL on Oct 22, 2023 15:24:09 GMT
It would indeed show that life, as defined by organisms that can replicate, exists on other planets. But it would not imply that these same organisms would be capable of interplanetary travel or of creating something similar to us.
At least not yet.
Do you think that Tardigrades could eventually evolve into an entity like us ? They are very resilient to a wide range of conditions that would like us homo saps'
If you follow the line of thinking that all life evolved from one single nucleus, which divided. Then there may be a case for the Tardigrades. We must have taken a similar form millions of years ago.
|
|
chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Oct 22, 2023 21:40:36 GMT
I don't believe in evolution, as much as I believe in creation. I don't think man, or even smaller zoological creatures for that matter, evolved from microbes. More like each species was created separate from another for some unknown purpose. It was once thought that Humans evolved from the Neanderthals. However, an archeological finding of a scull--a young female child I believe--not too long ago, half Human half Neanderthal, indicated that Neanderthals lived alongside with us some 50.000 years ago. We did not evolve from anything--we were simply somehow created. No, what I believe is that each species has its own purpose for being created. Such as the cyanobacteria, architects of the Earth's atmosphere ( click here for reference), whose job was to produce atmosphere and pave the way for other lifeforms to exist. Now as to how we came to be--the gathering of some complex amino acids in some African pond perhaps--which is for another discussion, I can't say. And that brings us to the next case in hand. Now what if let's say a Mars rover, or a satellite we sent into space brought back samples from an asteroid and was analyzed, and uncovered some exoplanetary lifeform, would that mean that there is intelligent life out there? No. But it would surely support the belief and theory that there could be. Of course, with so many galaxies, stars and planets out there, life could exist if there are some Earthlike planets out there--but too far for us to interact with in any way. And that, remains to be seen.
|
|
|
Post by HAL on Oct 23, 2023 12:18:34 GMT
So, if you reverse-engineer the human race you will finish up with just two people. This has to happen as everyone is born due to the intercourse of a woman and a man. If all the children born today were not born, and if all the mothers and fathers of the generation that has been avoided where not born, and so on back through time, you would have to finish up with just one breeding pair. Do you agree ?
If you do agree, but do not believe in evolution, then you are saying that there is no link between us and the next layer down i.e. the primates. Am I reading that correctly ?
As for purpose. It appears that everything feeds on the layer below it. Until it gets to us. We feed on whatever we want, but there is no natural predator above us. We are the crown of creation. If we were to remove any layer of critter below us something will suffer and may also become extinct. How many layers can we remove before our existence becomes unsustainable.
It would be interesting to work out just when the first human appeared in a recognisable form.
I do not agree with your understanding of creation. But I can't prove it is incorrect. Neither can I show that evolution is exactly as Darwin says it is. There does appear to be some awkward questions in it. But each to his own.
|
|
chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Oct 23, 2023 18:04:34 GMT
Evolution is in the very heart of things and cannot be dismissed. It is an integral aspect of the progression of some creation/manifestation as we move forward in time. Like the hammer for instance, the idea emerged when early homo sapiens wanted to construct a dwelling for protection against the elements and so on, by tying a rock to a stick. Which then evolved/progressed into the modern hardened stainless-steel tool we use today. (Wikipedia defines evolution much better than me of course.) I was not implying that evolution does not merit recognition--my bad. I had not intended to come out like some kind of a Darwinian creationist. Just looking to type something to pass the time with.
It is the age-old question of what came first the chicken or the egg? Procreation or man? That may take some more time to come up with a satisfactory answer. Perhaps at some future date.
Now clearly, Mother Earth plays a quintessential roll in the creation/production--after the Creator naturally-- of countless of lifeforms, and that of course include us. Which then progress/evolve into one thing or another as we move through time. What are her [Earth's] secrets of creation, which we may be able to use in an effort to terraform another celestial body such as the moon, Mars and so on in the not-too-distant future, remains to be seen.
And yeah, it would be great to know what Adam and Eve looked and were like before they evolved into us. Not just the physical form, but also the human soul. As well as social behavior, moral guidelines and etiquette since the beginning of man. Maybe someday we will have all the answers to the cosmos--above as well as below. But as for now, all we can do is continue to research.
|
|
|
Post by HAL on Oct 23, 2023 19:51:09 GMT
So where do you stand on Lovelock and Gaia ?
|
|
chillstar
Full Member
It takes all kinds to make a universe.
Posts: 155
|
Post by chillstar on Oct 24, 2023 20:08:22 GMT
This is an excerpt from Wikipedia: [ The Gaia principle, proposes that living organisms interact with their inorganic surroundings on Earth to form a synergistic and self-regulating, complex system that helps to maintain and perpetuate the conditions for life on the planet.] This theory is among the lines of my own viewpoint. It is a well-known fact, that different parts or soils of the Earth or Gaia, the Greek word pronunciations is more like Yi, have variating properties. Different stones. Different diatoms existing mostly in their own environment. Different trees, that have their own unique DNA etc.--all of which have been used in criminal cases to obtain a conviction (not relevant to this thread of course.) And thus, different organism manifesting all over the world--I don't want to say created, that may imply intent, no proof of that. (Oh boy, here we go again.) Now, certain elements, properties and conditions have to be present in order for life as we know it to emerge and continue to exist--if only briefly. Such as water, oxygen, atmosphere etc. As for silicon-based lifeforms--I'm not even going to touch that one. The point is, I don't believe that we evolved from tadpoles to fish that grew feet and came out of the oceans and so on. I think that that is more Sci-Fi than fact. I could be wrong of course. Well, through our telescopes we have spotted planets with water/oceans. Besides moons in our solar system like Europa. However, that may not be enough to produce and sustain life, big or small. More Earthlike conditions must be present in order for life, at least higher lifeforms such as us--or at least dog or ape-sized-- to immerge and develop. Me thinks.
|
|
|
Post by moksha on Oct 25, 2023 10:45:54 GMT
This is an excerpt from Wikipedia: [ The Gaia principle, proposes that living organisms interact with their inorganic surroundings on Earth to form a synergistic and self-regulating, complex system that helps to maintain and perpetuate the conditions for life on the planet.] This theory is among the lines of my own viewpoint. It is a well-known fact, that different parts or soils of the Earth or Gaia, the Greek word pronunciations is more like Yi, have variating properties. Different stones. Different diatoms existing mostly in their own environment. Different trees, that have their own unique DNA etc.--all of which have been used in criminal cases to obtain a conviction (not relevant to this thread of course.) And thus, different organism manifesting all over the world--I don't want to say created, that may imply intent, no proof of that. (Oh boy, here we go again.) Now, certain elements, properties and conditions have to be present in order for life as we know it to emerge and continue to exist--if only briefly. Such as water, oxygen, atmosphere etc. As for silicon-based lifeforms--I'm not even going to touch that one. The point is, I don't believe that we evolved from tadpoles to fish that grew feet and came out of the oceans and so on. I think that that is more Sci-Fi than fact. I could be wrong of course. Well, through our telescopes we have spotted planets with water/oceans. Besides moons in our solar system like Europa. However, that may not be enough to produce and sustain life, big or small. More Earthlike conditions must be present in order for life, at least higher lifeforms such as us--or at least dog or ape-sized-- to immerge and develop. Me thinks. www.insidescience.org/news/where-did-universes-magnetism-comeAncient Wi-fi Could be the beginning of matter, and it's still everywhere. MW
|
|
|
Post by buoyant on Jan 24, 2024 23:46:47 GMT
I had not intended to come out like some kind of a Darwinian creationist. There is no such thing as a Darwinian creationist. I don't care what your strange beliefs are but speciation by means of natural selection is a fact.
|
|
|
Post by buoyant on Jan 25, 2024 0:01:16 GMT
More like each species was created separate from another for some unknown purpose. Completely and utterly wrong. There are millions of different prokaryotic and Eukaryotic species which share a universal common ancestor. It was once thought that Humans evolved from the Neanderthals. Only by idiots. No, what I believe is that each species has its own purpose for being created. I don't care what you believe but assigning preplanned purpose to each species is wrong. The natural environment is an economy and sometimes one organism making its living had fortuitous side-effects for others organism as in the case of Cyanobacteria. I get the impression you are trying to sound profound but it's worthy of ridicule.
|
|
|
Post by WingsofCrystal on Jan 25, 2024 23:00:04 GMT
Be polite to the members of the forum buoyant. Don't call names. Crystal More like each species was created separate from another for some unknown purpose. Completely and utterly wrong. There are millions of different prokaryotic and Eukaryotic species which share a universal common ancestor. It was once thought that Humans evolved from the Neanderthals. Only by idiots. No, what I believe is that each species has its own purpose for being created. I don't care what you believe but assigning preplanned purpose to each species is wrong. The natural environment is an economy and sometimes one organism making its living had fortuitous side-effects for others organism as in the case of Cyanobacteria. I get the impression you are trying to sound profound but it's worthy of ridicule.
|
|