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Post by plutronus on May 28, 2020 14:43:01 GMT
We all need to remember, that misbehaving police officers need to be eliminated from society. However, to be fair, those people, are on the front lines between the raging of the misbehaving Blacks on the streets, who are 11% of the population, and yet who are also the perpetrators of 90% of the crime. We have been programmed by the politically correct to not speak of these things or be deemed racist! But the reality is reality, and we need to start thinking about how to resolve these matters. Censoring thought is a bad process and that is exactly what is happening, while the police officers are trying, hopefully within the constraints of the law, to keep the misbehaving at bay, out of our lives, to enable the safety for all of the members of the public. They are catching the sh.it from all sides and when they get caught doing what looks like bad behavior the police become the victums of the actions of the politically correct partly due to the PC imposed thinking constraints. However, here is the social problem, some of the police are in fact misbehaving and we need to learn how to remove those people from public police service. There have always been bad cops in our society and generally they don't just mistreat Blacks, but all of the people within their power spectrum.
It aint right what happened to Black Floyd, but then, who knows what the true story is? Maybe there is something happening we all don't know about that mitigated the event? Maybe that cop just snapped? But what about all the other cops who standing around near the police instantiated crime activity? What is it that prevented them from doing, apparently, from the public perspective, the right thing, by stopping the apparently misbehaving policeman who was apparently cruelly mistreating Black-Floyd? Maybe it was personal payback for something hidden from public view? Maybe that policeman is simply a bad cop, but why were all the other policemen not stopping his misactions? Simply within the rule of law, policemen are not judge, jury and excecutioners for a reason and those policemen in Minneapolis violated that public trust!! Because they did not uphold the public laws of the land and that includes safety for prisoners, irregardless of how nasty they may in fact be misbehaving on the streets!
Or maybe its because the police departments of the US specifically don't employ or train higher IQ people for police service? Historically the higher IQ people who attend the police academy training, most of the costs of which are subsidized by tax payers, and upon graduation are assigned jobs, but after a short period, greater than 50% of the higher IQ graduates leave the police service, as they can't stand to work with all the bone-head dummies and idiots!! A high IQ Los Angeles Police Academy applicant was denied entrance to the Academy. He fought the decision all the way to the California Supreme Court, who decided in favor of the Police Academy decision. He was too smart.
The public is looking in from outside into a private, socially complicated, very tough and rough, whose employees experience in their daily taskes, mostly unpleasant experiences, of the misbehaving public, via their social management agency known as the Police. I do not condone what happened, but do I really know what happened simply relying that I saw it on TV? From the public's perspective this looks to be just another random act of cruelty by an out-of-control viscious mistreating another poor Black Man, police officer...but all those cops standing around that event in Minneapolis, they are those people who patrol those streets. They know personally who the trouble makers are, who the robbers are, who the violent people are. Because they see them all the time on their patrol routes, day in and day out. That is what the public isn't privey too. Cops are just people and sometimes they dole out street justice where they feel it is needed. Is it right? The law is the law and everyone should abide by it, but the Blacks aren't, and they want to be left alone and they are screaming that they are being targeted, singled out for mistreatment, while they are the perpetrators of 90% of the crime. Being a policeman is a tough job. But then my Dad always said, "Son there are two groups of people you don't want to run into at 3am, gang bangers or the police!"
That job is not for me. Too tough and ya gotta deal with all the lying, deceitful, dishonest, theiving, cruds of society, who act a lot like politicians?!
plutronus
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2020 7:09:26 GMT
Hi plutronus, I actually agree with a lot of what you say.... I come from a police family... there is always another side to every story.... and a background story that most are not privy too.
There are good and evil people the world over, whether they are cops, financiers, lawyers, politicians, whatever profession.... I feel for all the good cops, because the bad ones put a target on the good ones back.....
The officer that committed this murder, and it was murder, because the man was saying he could not breathe...yet he kept his knee on his throat and the weight of his body shut off the man's air supply.... got off for a shooting some years back....
I think the other officers that were there should have stopped the officer who had his knee on the throat... they were accessories to murder.... and also should be brought before the courts, not just fired.
Amy Klobuchar failed to prosecute officer at center of Floyd's death: Rpt
What I find appalling is the rioters and looters are using this man's death to create chaos and steal as much as they can.... they even attacked an invalid in a wheelchair, repeatedly punching her in the back of the head and spraying her with a fire extinguisher. I take it that the people doing this are Democrat voters, considering that its a Democrat run State at every level?
They are looting and destroying businesses and the private property of people that are innocent and had nothing to do with the murder..... I think their behaviour is absolutely reprehensible. They need to be brought under control.... its way out of hand.
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Post by SysConfig on May 29, 2020 11:57:06 GMT
Of course ..there is another angle They knew each other worked the same security gig till last year do we know if this guy really dead?
But I 'll stick to what we have.. heavy.com/news/2020/05/george-floyd-video/He acknowledged that “a lot of people are focusing on the knee across the neck, which looks awful, but I think the more pertinent and it is a problematic aspect of this arrest was the amount of time they kept him in a prone position.” He said that he can’t think of positional asphyxia cases in which officers were charged criminally, but that civil liability has been more common. “They are so few and far between,” he said of criminal charges in those cases. “It’s always difficult to prosecute cops for on-duty uses of force.” He added that, whether the officers can be prosecuted for a homicide offense, “depends on what the medical examiner determines the cause of death to be.” If the medical examiner says Floyd died of a drug overdose or kidney failure or something like that and the officers did not contribute to his death, he thinks they won’t be prosecuted for homicide. He stressed that he has no knowledge that Floyd was on or had those things and was just using them as a general example. “If the medical examiner concludes they did contribute to his death, then that opens up a possibility of a homicide offense,” he said, adding that Minnesota has multiple different homicide offenses. He said he thinks charges for second-degree or third-degree murder of manslaughter are “all plausible” but the “big obstacle in prosecuting cops is proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the officers’ actions were not authorized. Officers are allowed to use force to make an arrest. Minnesota has two different statutes that authorize police to use force.” If charges result, he said, the prosecutor “should be putting on evidence from trainers at that organization, or the Minnesota police academy, as well as expert testimony that putting someone in a prone position and keeping them in that amount of time is wrong.” He said that “officers are trained to do exactly the opposite.” It’s clear from the video that someone called paramedics who eventually arrived, but, Stoughton said, “It doesn’t really matter why they called the paramedics. They still shouldn’t have kept him on his stomach for that amount of time. Even if you’re waiting for the paramedics, get him out of the prone position.” As for the other three officers who aren’t Chauvin, he said prosecutors will have to show they were a “part of his cause of death. If they had used force on him, used hands on, that’s a little easier – if they actively contributed.” He said criminal liability will be tougher to prove in a case like Officer Thao’s where he was standing there and interceding with bystanders, according to the video. Stoughton said the other officers could theoretically have criminal liability for failing to act. “A prosecutor might argue that Officer Thao caused or contributed to his (Floyd’s) death by not intervening,” he said. Stoughton said the officers had a moral and professional duty to intervene but whether that falls under criminal statues will turn on a complex reading of Minnesota law. |
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Post by buzzbomb on May 29, 2020 17:02:04 GMT
We all need to remember, that misbehaving police officers need to be eliminated from society. However, to be fair, those people, are on the front lines between the raging of the misbehaving Blacks on the streets, who are 11% of the population, and yet who are also the perpetrators of 90% of the crime. We have been programmed by the politically correct to not speak of these things or be deemed racist!
plutronus
You ARE racist. Sorry, someone here has to say it. I'm frankly shocked at the race-baiting that goes on in this forum. I know that people who believe in UFOs are generally nutjobs and weirdos and not usually the nicest people you'll ever run into but even so...there is a lot of race-baiting and general bigotry that goes on in here unchallenged. According to the US Census, blacks are 13% of the population and according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, black offenders have committed 52% of the crime from 1980 to 2008. Not that this isn't a problem but it's a FAR cry from 90% which even a simpleton would know couldn't possibly be right. And while blacks do indeed commit crime out of proportion to their numbers, their victims are overwhelmingly also black. Black victimization is also WAY out of proportion to their numbers. Whites are NOT victims. The same BoJ statistics point out that whites commit 45% of all the crime in the US--much of it directed at racial minorities. Areas where there are a lot Asian-Americans or Canadians can attest to that: |
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Post by SysConfig on May 29, 2020 18:46:14 GMT
Sorry..someone making a statistical error ..hardly racist..I always thought the Mexicans in jail had the stats..truth be told..not productive to go on then say it describes some hidden trait of the UCB members at large. Anal retentive maybe isolated instances, eccentric? ? but certainly not by and large racist or bigots.. ? We all have one of those too. so it all depends where you are standing ..From here it does seem..you may have some issues you need to work on anger mgmt..I suspect....and..You probably owe him an apology..but thats not the way to address that problem even if it were true.
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Post by buzzbomb on May 30, 2020 17:46:24 GMT
Sorry..someone making a statistical error ..hardly racist..I always thought the Mexicans in jail had the stats..truth be told..not productive to go on then say it describes some hidden trait of the UCB members at large. Anal retentive maybe isolated instances, eccentric? ? but certainly not by and large racist or bigots.. ? We all have one of those too. so it all depends where you are standing ..From here it does seem..you may have some issues you need to work on anger mgmt..I suspect....and..You probably owe him an apology..but thats not the way to address that problem even if it were true. That's hardly a statistical error. If he said 60% I might have overlooked it but 90% is too high to be anything other than a racist statement. That is essentially saying that if there were no black people in this country there would be no crime. Anybody should be able to puzzle out that such a statistic cannot be true. Was it a statistical error when Donald Trump released info during his campaign that most white people are killed by blacks? About 84% of whites are killed by whites. Trump's statistic ignores that most people who get murdered in this country will be murdered by someone they know. Where did the Trump campaign get that well-researched factoid? From a white supremacist website. The 2020 campaign is now using the old VDARE logo. The hate has become so normalized, it has to be called out whenever it is exhibited. We ignore it at our peril. |
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Post by purr on May 30, 2020 17:54:04 GMT
Sorry..someone making a statistical error ..hardly racist..I always thought the Mexicans in jail had the stats..truth be told..not productive to go on then say it describes some hidden trait of the UCB members at large. Anal retentive maybe isolated instances, eccentric? ? but certainly not by and large racist or bigots.. ? We all have one of those too. so it all depends where you are standing ..From here it does seem..you may have some issues you need to work on anger mgmt..I suspect....and..You probably owe him an apology..but thats not the way to address that problem even if it were true. I like how your analytical mind works, Sysconfig  ! Of course I'm looking at all this big media big think BIG WORD (like "racist") frenzy from the safe distance of a sleepy rural town in the Netherlands where folks at one time, about a decade ago, excitedly reported back to their families having encountered (and usually making some polite small talk with) the one police officer patrolling our streets on foot keeping us safe. Today occasionally one patrol car rolls in, in response to the inevitable yet still slight increase in crime, mostly imported from the larger cities where gangs have regular shoot-outs and execute criminal competitors in cold blood, and still I can't resist looking at these officers' sudden appearance in our street with surprise, even wonder much like I would if an Unidentified Flying Object had plotted its trajectory to pass slowly rumbling over my home. I totally acknowledge that George Floyd's detainment and ensuing death has American context stemming from centuries of evil and unjust treatment of black people through Slavery, indeed persisting racism and inequality under the law long after this horrific practice ended, and discrimination (as 20th century African-Americans have successfully struggled to fully emancipate under the law) unfortunately continuing to this day. But imho all of that became irrelevant the moment the police officer (I hear along with his team of responders) who is suspected of causing the death of mr. Floyd while in his custody, in handcuffs, under control by using a knee restraint on his neck, was arrested. The core question is: what happened here, who/what caused George Floyd's death, what was the arresting officers' state of mind, and where exactly did they act in breach of protocol? (I for one am not assuming the police acted from racist motivation, unless facts point us in that direction: this could easily be an attempt to restrain a suspect gone horribly wrong.) And if the police did wrong, there should be repercussions under the appropriate law.
purr
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Post by SysConfig on May 30, 2020 18:41:20 GMT
Buzz :there is a lot of race-baiting and general bigotry that goes on in here unchallenged. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof can you cite any..even ordinary post..as defacto proof....of what you just claimed.
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Post by purr on May 30, 2020 19:29:57 GMT
Sorry..someone making a statistical error ..hardly racist..I always thought the Mexicans in jail had the stats..truth be told..not productive to go on then say it describes some hidden trait of the UCB members at large. Anal retentive maybe isolated instances, eccentric? ? but certainly not by and large racist or bigots.. ? We all have one of those too. so it all depends where you are standing ..From here it does seem..you may have some issues you need to work on anger mgmt..I suspect....and..You probably owe him an apology..but thats not the way to address that problem even if it were true. That's hardly a statistical error. If he said 60% I might have overlooked it but 90% is too high to be anything other than a racist statement. That is essentially saying that if there were no black people in this country there would be no crime. Anybody should be able to puzzle out that such a statistic cannot be true. Was it a statistical error when Donald Trump released info during his campaign that most white people are killed by blacks? About 84% of whites are killed by whites. Trump's statistic ignores that most people who get murdered in this country will be murdered by someone they know. Where did the Trump campaign get that well-researched factoid? From a white supremacist website. The 2020 campaign is now using the old VDARE logo. The hate has become so normalized, it has to be called out whenever it is exhibited. We ignore it at our peril. Buzzbomb, I will unequivocally state here my belief that racism is real. My country the Netherlands has its own troubled (and long denied) history with slaving and colonialism, but looking across the pond at your American Civil Rights Movement the long suffering of Africans taken captive to the Americas to a life of generational slavery is literally beyond comprehension. I already used the word "evil" to describe this history. Reading and contemplating this struggle to be free I see Reverend Martin Luther King as a kind of Moses leading out a modern Exodus of the forever worthy and proud children of Black Slaves. Fascinating also how a living and unique Christian Faith among slaves and their descendants has always been a vital resource of America's black community. I imagine that God loves African Americans and their lives and well-being matter to Him. That said, a few points popping into my mind. Crime rate statistics comparing ethnic groups seem invariably out of balance. The imbalance might be affected by nations and tribes each having their own unique history, for instance recently emerging out of an honor culture dominated by young men, or evolving a society based on democracy and the rule of law, or (indeed!) having been victimized by cruel injustice for past centuries, and finally some genetic variation between races. As an evolutionist reader (fav author Steven Pinker) I have been convinced there is no human tribe with an overall greater genetic predisposition to commit crime than others. The science of Genetics indicates the greatest variety of behavioral traits occurs WITHIN an ethnic group. Simply, every race has its own bad seeds, every generation! Mentioning different crime rates (statistically) for ethnic groups does 'suggest' many things. I am using my freedom as a democratic citizen to say what (I believe) they really mean  . purr
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Post by purr on Jun 12, 2020 0:24:22 GMT
We all need to remember, that misbehaving police officers need to be eliminated from society. However, to be fair, those people, are on the front lines between the raging of the misbehaving Blacks on the streets, who are 11% of the population, and yet who are also the perpetrators of 90% of the crime. We have been programmed by the politically correct to not speak of these things or be deemed racist! But the reality is reality, and we need to start thinking about how to resolve these matters. Censoring thought is a bad process and that is exactly what is happening, while the police officers are trying, hopefully within the constraints of the law, to keep the misbehaving at bay, out of our lives, to enable the safety for all of the members of the public. They are catching the sh.it from all sides and when they get caught doing what looks like bad behavior the police become the victums of the actions of the politically correct partly due to the PC imposed thinking constraints. However, here is the social problem, some of the police are in fact misbehaving and we need to learn how to remove those people from public police service. There have always been bad cops in our society and generally they don't just mistreat Blacks, but all of the people within their power spectrum.
It aint right what happened to Black Floyd, but then, who knows what the true story is? Maybe there is something happening we all don't know about that mitigated the event? Maybe that cop just snapped? But what about all the other cops who standing around near the police instantiated crime activity? What is it that prevented them from doing, apparently, from the public perspective, the right thing, by stopping the apparently misbehaving policeman who was apparently cruelly mistreating Black-Floyd? Maybe it was personal payback for something hidden from public view? Maybe that policeman is simply a bad cop, but why were all the other policemen not stopping his misactions? Simply within the rule of law, policemen are not judge, jury and excecutioners for a reason and those policemen in Minneapolis violated that public trust!! Because they did not uphold the public laws of the land and that includes safety for prisoners, irregardless of how nasty they may in fact be misbehaving on the streets!
Or maybe its because the police departments of the US specifically don't employ or train higher IQ people for police service? Historically the higher IQ people who attend the police academy training, most of the costs of which are subsidized by tax payers, and upon graduation are assigned jobs, but after a short period, greater than 50% of the higher IQ graduates leave the police service, as they can't stand to work with all the bone-head dummies and idiots!! A high IQ Los Angeles Police Academy applicant was denied entrance to the Academy. He fought the decision all the way to the California Supreme Court, who decided in favor of the Police Academy decision. He was too smart.
The public is looking in from outside into a private, socially complicated, very tough and rough, whose employees experience in their daily taskes, mostly unpleasant experiences, of the misbehaving public, via their social management agency known as the Police. I do not condone what happened, but do I really know what happened simply relying that I saw it on TV? From the public's perspective this looks to be just another random act of cruelty by an out-of-control viscious mistreating another poor Black Man, police officer...but all those cops standing around that event in Minneapolis, they are those people who patrol those streets. They know personally who the trouble makers are, who the robbers are, who the violent people are. Because they see them all the time on their patrol routes, day in and day out. That is what the public isn't privey too. Cops are just people and sometimes they dole out street justice where they feel it is needed. Is it right? The law is the law and everyone should abide by it, but the Blacks aren't, and they want to be left alone and they are screaming that they are being targeted, singled out for mistreatment, while they are the perpetrators of 90% of the crime. Being a policeman is a tough job. But then my Dad always said, "Son there are two groups of people you don't want to run into at 3am, gang bangers or the police!"
That job is not for me. Too tough and ya gotta deal with all the lying, deceitful, dishonest, theiving, cruds of society, who act a lot like politicians?!
plutronus
Hi Plutronus, just to get it out of the way: (feel free to respond!) the opposite of "misbehaving Blacks" to my mind would of course not be 'white people' but 'folks who do not misbehave of any color' including good decent Black Citizens. Also it is a no-brainer that Police working a neighborhood with a lot of black residents (plus the inevitable sprinkling of organized crime over-representing that same ethnicity) may confront and be required to stop/arrest a majority of black suspects over the course of a normal day's work. Nothing to do with racism unless such hateful resentments have taken root in an individual police officer's mind and heart. What I get though, and resonate with in your post is a sense of concern bordering on deep apprehension over what the hell is happening in American society since George Floyd's botched arrest. To position myself here, the rioting (too often misreported as 'protests' in international media) I totally reject. I suspect some of the looting is nothing more than opportunistic gang activity, criminals callously using Floyd's death as cover for a hugely profitable heist. But I sense big problems with the (more or less) peaceful protests as well. Parts are OK: on the face of it a team of police officers caused mr. Floyd's death while arresting him. Creating a ruckus (with a wealth of video footage as proof) to ensure that the arresting officers get arrested and charged themselves is responsible citizenship. ...DONE... After that the protesters kinda lost me, the officers will go before the courts. WHAT MORE CAN YOU ASK FOR? Effectively demanding the head perpetrator (alleged) be convicted of murder, and a racist one to boot infringes on Judicial independence and seems to threaten mob justice. Everybody knows they're guilty, right... right...? I'm all in favor of fighting racism in America and everywhere, but that is imo a matter of politics, not necessarily the same issue as 'getting justice' for George Floyd who lost his life, and the four arresting officers Chauvin and his partner Thao, assisted by Lane and Kueng. Drowning out the shouting I ask WHAT HAPPENED. Asking as if I don't know and want to find out. A BASIC TIMELINE
On the evening of Memorial Day, May 25, 2020, Floyd purchased cigarettes at Cup Foods, a grocery store at the intersection of East 38th Street and Chicago Avenue in the Powderhorn Park neighborhood of Minneapolis. A store employee believed Floyd had paid with a counterfeit $20 bill.
Just before 8:00 pm, two Cup Foods employees left the store and crossed the street to an SUV parked in front of a restaurant; Floyd was in the driver's seat and two other adults were in the vehicle. The employees demanded that Floyd return the cigarettes, and he refused. The interaction was filmed by the restaurant's security camera. At 8:01, a store employee called police to report that Floyd had passed "fake bills" and was "awfully drunk" and "not in control of himself".
At 8:08, Kueng and Lane arrived, briefly entering Cup Foods before crossing the street to Floyd's SUV. Lane drew his gun and ordered Floyd to put his hands on the steering wheel; Floyd complied and Lane holstered his weapon. Someone parked behind Floyd's SUV began recording a video at Following a brief struggle, Lane pulled Floyd from the SUV and handcuffed him. At 8:12, Kueng sat Floyd on the sidewalk against the wall in front of the restaurant. According to criminal complaints filed against the officers by state prosecutors, Floyd was "calm" and said "thank you" At 8:13, Kueng and Lane told Floyd he was under arrest and walked him to their police car across the street. Floyd fell to the ground next to the car; the officers picked him up and placed him against the car's door. According to prosecutors, Floyd told the officers that he was not resisting, but that he was claustrophobic and did not want to sit in the car. A Minneapolis Park Police officer arrived and guarded Floyd's vehicle (across the street by the restaurant) and the two people who had been in it with Floyd.
At 8:17, a third police car arrived with officers Derek Michael Chauvin and Tou Thao, who joined Kueng and Lane. Chauvin assumed command. According to prosecutors, Floyd told the officers he could not breathe while they tried to force him into the car. Around 8:18, security footage from Cup Foods shows Kueng struggling with Floyd for at least a minute in the driver side backseat while Thao watches. At 8:19, standing on the passenger side of the vehicle, Chauvin pulled Floyd across the backseat from the driver side to the passenger side, then out of the car. Floyd, still handcuffed, fell to the pavement where he lay on his chest with his cheek to the ground. Floyd stopped moving around 8:20, though he was still conscious. Multiple witnesses began to film the encounter, and their videos were circulated widely on the internet. At 8:20, a witness across the street began recording video showing Chauvin kneeling on Floyd's neck, Kueng applying pressure to Floyd's torso, and Lane applying pressure to Floyd's legs, while Thao stood nearby. This witness stopped filming when one of the officers ordered him to leave. Also at 8:20, a second person, standing near the entrance of Cup Foods, began recording the incident. Floyd can be heard repeatedly saying "I can't breathe", "Please", and "Mama"; Floyd repeated at least 16 times that he could not breathe. At one point a witness said: "You got him down. Let him breathe." After Floyd said, "I'm about to die", Chauvin told him to "relax". An officer asked Floyd, "What do you want?"; Floyd answered, "I can't breathe". Floyd states: "Please, the knee in my neck, I can't breathe." At approximately 8:22, the officers called for an ambulance on a non-emergency basis, escalating the call to emergency status a minute later. Chauvin continued to kneel on Floyd's neck. A passerby yelled to Floyd, "Well, get up, get in the car, man", and Floyd, still handcuffed and face down on the pavement, responded, "I can't", while Chauvin's knee remained on his neck. Floyd cried out "Mama!" twice. Floyd said, "My stomach hurts, my neck hurts, everything hurts", requested water, and begged, "Don't kill me." One witness pointed out that Floyd was bleeding from the nose. Another told the officers that Floyd was "not even resisting arrest right now". Thao countered that Floyd was "talking, he's fine"; a witness replied that Floyd "ain't fine ... Get him off the ground ... You could have put him in the car by now. He's not resisting arrest or nothing. You're enjoying it. Look at you. Your body language explains it." As Floyd continued to cry for help, Thao said to witnesses: "This is why you don't do drugs, kids."
By 8:25, Floyd appeared unconscious, and bystanders confronted the officers about Floyd's condition. Chauvin pulled out mace to keep bystanders away as Thao moved between them and Chauvin. Bystanders repeatedly yelled that Floyd was "not responsive right now" and urged the officers to check his pulse. Kueng checked Floyd's wrist but found no pulse; the officers did not attempt to provide Floyd with medical assistance. According to the criminal complaint against Chauvin, Lane asked Chauvin twice if they should move Floyd onto his side, and Chauvin said no. A witness asked, "Did they fucking kill him?" At 8:27 pm, a Hennepin County ambulance arrived. Shortly thereafter, a young relative of the owner of Cup Foods attempted to intervene, but was pushed back by Thao. Emergency medical technicians checked Floyd's pulse. Chauvin kept his knee on Floyd's neck for almost a minute after the ambulance arrived, despite Floyd being silent and motionless. When he finally did lift his knee, it had been there for eight minutes and forty-six seconds.
Around 8:29, Floyd was lifted by paramedics onto a stretcher, then loaded into an ambulance which departed for Hennepin County Medical Center. En route, the ambulance requested assistance from the Minneapolis Fire Department. At 8:32, firefighters arrived at Cup Foods; according to their report, the police officers gave no clear information regarding Floyd's condition or whereabouts, which delayed their ability to find the ambulance. Meanwhile, the ambulance reported that Floyd was entering cardiac arrest and again requested assistance, asking firefighters to meet them at the corner of 36th Street and Park Avenue. Five minutes later, the fire department reached the ambulance; two fire department medics who boarded the ambulance found Floyd unresponsive and pulseless.
Floyd was pronounced dead at 9:25 at the Hennepin County Medical Center emergency room. The more complete picture will emerge during trial, when witnesses and (I hope, from an information standpoint) the defendant police officers will testify under oath as to what they heard and saw and did, and what their state of mind was as these fateful events transpired. But the as yet basic, relatively superficial timeline I found on Wikipedia (lacking all the 'why's I want answered) as I read through is heartrending. Seems at some point around 8:22 PM George Floyd knew he was going to die, he begged for his life with the police to no avail, called for his Mama and soon after the dead silence began, he was passing away. Dying for everyone is a big deal, it is a hard thing to do, and at this moment I am sad our fellow traveler under God's Heaven George Floyd had such a hard time of it. WHAT HAPPENED? Truth... I do not know. I will put my trust in the American justice system, rapturously listen to the Verdict, and then come to a private judgement of the heart, my personal opinion. There is a model forming in my mind now (2 cts. worth) which goes like this. Floyd paid for cigarettes at Cup Foods with a $20 bill that shop personnel believed to be counterfeit currency, so they called the police and confronted him and his friends sitting in their car in front of a Chinese restaurant across the road. First responders were officers Kueng and Lane and I believe it was with them mr. Floyd initiated a pattern of on-off compliance versus non-compliance plus erratic behavior: I presume he was asked to step out of his vehicle by Lane, which he didn't, so we see (multiple angles of video available) him being pulled out and with some difficulty getting handcuffed by Lane. Kueng then sits him against the wall of the restaurant, George now is polite and cooperative. Officers take him back crossing the road to Cup Foods, Floyd now struggles to avoid being placed in the cruiser claiming 'claustrophobia' (probably hard to swallow for Lane and Kueng since Floyd just had been stopped while sitting inside his own car!) as back up arrives in the form of Chauvin and Thao. As efforts continued to put him in the police car George Floyd began vocalizing 'he could not breathe'. I believe the two unbelievable claims of being claustrophobic and being unable to breathe inside a police vehicle led the four officers, now with veteran Chauvin in command, to assume Floyd was making it up as he went along, and perhaps even out of his efening mind. They suspected substance abuse. I note that repeating "I can't breathe" is a highly charged political slogan, going back to Eric Garner and earlier, and the officers may well have tagged him as a kind of big, strong, UNPREDICTABLE, drama queen. After Chauvin took him down and moved into a knee pindown, Floyd continued repeating "I can't breathe" at least 16 times within the time frame 8:20-8:22 pm. Chauvin made the (now seen as fatal) assessment that Floyd's cries and complaints were mere theater, more playing to his street audience, evidence of non-compliant intent, and continued the downward knee pressure to the suspect's neck area. Chauvin thought it was all an act and expected to eventually wear the big guy down, so he could eventually be placed in the cruiser. Worse, when around 8:22 Floyd fell silent, I think Chauvin thought HE PLAYED DEAD and continued to hold Floyd down! Chauvin ended the knee pindown only after nearly 9 minutes. If I am right officer Chauvin made a terrible error in judgement, one for which he must be held accountable by law, as must his support team for their roles, but this would not be murder. This is just my personal model of how George Floyd's arrest went horribly wrong. Not all the facts are in, any finding is possible, one that an American Court will rightfully decide. purr
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Post by SysConfig on Jun 12, 2020 2:41:10 GMT
It's ok Purr..Joe Biden just secured the office of the presidency for himself /0 
Yes he said that..and for whatever reason we can't play twitter feeds here..I'm happy he said it. and yes that is a Black Mask not a Kotex dangling from his ear as he spoke.
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! Of course I'm looking at all this big media big think BIG WORD (like "racist") frenzy from the safe distance of a sleepy rural town in the Netherlands where folks at one time, about a decade ago, excitedly reported back to their families having encountered (and usually making some polite small talk with) the one police officer patrolling our streets on foot keeping us safe. Today occasionally one patrol car rolls in, in response to the inevitable yet still slight increase in crime, mostly imported from the larger cities where gangs have regular shoot-outs and execute criminal competitors in cold blood, and still I can't resist looking at these officers' sudden appearance in our street with surprise, even wonder much like I would if an Unidentified Flying Object had plotted its trajectory to pass slowly rumbling over my home.
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